[BoOZe P-ti Motard]

try a 2002 vmax and tell me…

BoOZe
Solomolo Rider

[kirk]

Hey Bud.
I wish I had a better answer as to why I went with the upgrade that I did.
I knew that I wanted more power. I had my mind set on the Suzuki GSX 650. I went to the dealer and I said, “Gimme that one.” He explained to me that he would recommend the Honda CBR for several reasons. It cost the same as the 650. In his opinion, the 650 was more of a track bike while the CBR handled well in both street and track. He did ask about my experience and what I wanted it for. At no time did I feel that he was pressuring me to buy one over the other. I really felt that he was offering his true opinion. I don’t do track riding. I mostly use my bike for work and on the weekends for semi long rides.
So far I am glad I made the change. It took a little getting used to but now I am comfortable on my CBR. It handles like a dream and that power is just amazing.
Keep in mind that I am a 38 y/o rider that always wears safety gear and I don’t do crazy stunts. I truly enjoy riding and I am always cognisant of my abilities.

[ShannonG]

I would have thoiught just the opposite. The GSX is marketed as more of a sport tourer.

[megaspaz]

It is?

—
If there’s anything more important than my ego
around, I want it caught and shot now…

[WeaponZero]

The GSX650F is marketed as a budget sport tourer, essentially a cheaper honda VFR. It has an I-4 powerplant derived from the GSXR series but detuned to produce less top end power and more low-mid range, essentially to make it act more like a twin. The riding position is more like a standard than an actual sportbike. The wheelbase is even longer than typical sportbikes for increased highway stability at the cost of a little bit of handling. You could almost say that it basically is a GS500F (which is more of a standard with bodywork than an actual sportbike) with an I4 engine. Motorcycle.com did a review on it where they compared it to an SV650S, saying despite the full fairing and bodywork, it is actually LESS sporty of a ride than the SV650S and that it is much better and more practical for the roads than the SV650S.

It is NOT a track bike, it is NOT a supersport/repliracer. It is a mechanically redesigned Katana 600 which, for those of you old enough to remember, was Suzuki’s 600cc racebike back in the ’80s and even back then it sacrificed track prowess for real world comfort and driving. There was a reason it had a 5 gallon fuel tank as opposed to the competitors’ 4 gallon tanks, and I THINK that the GSX650F retains the 5.5 gallon fuel capacity of the 1998+ Katana 600. If the fact that it has a 5.5 gallon fuel tank and a really tall, upright windscreen, and standard-style riding position doesn’t convince you that it was clearly designed as a budget sport tourer, then I don’t know what will…

The fact that the reviews say it is even more mild mannered than the SV650 and designed more with real world riding in mind would lead me to believe that it is every bit as suitable of a beginner bike than the SV650, if not moreso. So if you consider the SV650 to be a suitable first bike, then you should also consider the GSX650F in the same league. If, however, all you can see is fully faired 650cc I4, then you’re not seeing the whole picture.

[megaspaz]

At a dry weight of 475 lbs., I wouldn’t consider this in the same league as the SV650.

—
If there’s anything more important than my ego
around, I want it caught and shot now…

[WeaponZero]

The weight goes along with the sport touring design. They’re not made to be lightweight because the weight apparently adds to highway stability. It may make low speed maneuvers harder for a beginner (and I’ll admit, low speed maneuvers on rough roads or hills are the hardest thing for a beginner to master), but it is overall a more friendly and mild-mannered ride and is certainly no repli-racer. It doesn’t even have a lick of track potential no matter what you mod it with.

[megaspaz]

Which reinforces my point that this bike isn’t in the same league as the sv650 in terms of beginner bikes. Weight, imo, makes a big difference in noob friendliness. If we’re going by marketing class of bikes, the sv650s is billed as a sports tourer as well. Given the choice between looking at a sv650s or the gsx650f, the gsx650f would never get recommended by me to a new rider.

—
If there’s anything more important than my ego
around, I want it caught and shot now…

[WeaponZero]

That may be but still, I know quite a lot of people who started out on older 600cc “race” bikes from the 80s and early 90s such as the Katana 600 and IF this really is simply a mechanically updated Katana 600 then I don’t see anything wrong with a beginner who’s willing to shell out money for fairing repairs/bodywork when (not if, but WHEN) they drop it to start out on it.

600cc sportbikes in the ’80s and early ’90s were MUCH more mild mannered than they are now, and while I do agree that a modern 600cc sportbike does not belong in the hands of a beginner, my opinion can differ when you start lumping 20 year old CBR600 Hurricanes, Katanas, and FZR600s in with modern GSXRs and CBR600RRs, and R6s. This is not an opinion that comes from personal experience, it is an opinion that comes from friends who have been riding a lot longer than I have who started out their riding careers on bikes like an ’89 Katana 600.

[Matt]

Weapon, Spaz isn’t arguing with you about manners of the bike, he’s arguing simply about the sheer weight of the bike.

I can say from personal experience that the difference in confidence between a 325 pound bike versus a well balanced 415 pound bike is still significant. The difference between a 415 pound bike and a 450 pound bike is also significant. With a full tank of gas the Katana (and GSX650) is a handleful a slow speeds and pushing around / putting on its stand. Twice I almost dropped my 415pound bike but was just able to recover it. My dad HAS dropped his 425 pound bike because it got over too far (at a stand still) when he wasn’t paying attention. I have never had that problem with my ZZR-250, it can get leaned out very far with me on the other side, and I never feel like I’m going to drop it. This has a huge impact on general comfort with the bike.

And don’t kid yourself about the weight being for stability. The Kat is a pig because it was designed in the 80s, when all sport bikes weighed that much. Making a steel frame stiff with 80s metalurgy means weight. A lot more weight than a current aluminum frame (and that massive 5 gallons of fuel, up high does nothing good for low speed balance). The GSX650 is still that heavy because steel is cheaper to buy and work with than aluminum. They could have saved a fair chunk of weight by doing a full redesign of the frame, but they didn’t have to because the GSX650 is, as you said, an affordable sport tourer.

I’ve spoken with a late model Kat 600 owner. He LOVES his bike. It is fast and comfy. It’ll keep up with his buddies on CBRs and he can tour with his Dad on a Goldwing. But he spent the first few years riding a GS500, and he wouldn’t have done it any other way.

As always, you can learn on any bike, but not all bikes are friendly to new riders.

—
“The two seconds between ‘Oh S**!’ and the crash isn’t a lot of practice time.”

[Rab]

I own a GSX650F.

The GSX650F is the well established European model Suzuki Bandit with a full fairing; new (in the USA anyway) for the 2008 model year. It’s essentially a tricked-out, sporty, standard, the total of which is more than the sum of its parts. It would also make an ideal low-cost sport tourer (Hard luggage and racks are available for it from Givi, etc. – see http://www.twistedthrottle.com).

While I wouldn’t recommend any 650 twin or I-4 as a beginner bike (especially a fully faired one), I believe that the GSX650F is as user friendly as any other 650. With its friendly gear ratios, it can be ridden mildly if you so choose. If you twist the throttle, then the bike will immediately start moving faster in a very linear way, almost like a rheostat, or turning a faucet more on or more off; there are no “oh sh*t” moments as you hit a particular rev range and it suddenly pulls your arms out of their sockets like some real sport bikes. It won’t wheelie without you trying to either (which suits me just fine).

The “weight issue” is a complete non-issue on this bike as it doesn’t feel heavy at all due to the low center of gravity (and yes, the weight is due to the traditional steel, double-cradle frame). In real-life motorcycling, the weight is actually an advantage and it *does* truly increase the stability and wind resistance of the bike (a big deal on my freeway and bridge commute). The roadholding on this bike is nothing short of amazing; it just feels so safe and secure at any speed. It’s no slouch either and you’ll be at 100 m.p.h. without realizing it (top speed reportedly 130-138 m.p.h.). The engine doesn’t even notice when you have a passenger on the back; very torquey for an I-4. SV650 0-60 in 3.5 seconds, GSX650F 0-60 in 3.8 seconds.

No, your Ricky Racers won’t appreciate this bike, as going fast on this bike, doesn’t feel like you’re going fast, if feels like safe, comfortable and secure.

Read the press reviews (all glowing) and take what the internet forum “experts” say with a handfull of salt. Most of ’em have never even seen a GSX650F in the flesh let alone ridden one.

[BoOZe P-ti Motard]

ok… clapping clapping… hail hail…
well this bike sure is a fast enough rokcket but the real power of course is at the end rpms.. but i heard its kinda lil heavier but handles quite nicely on the road… and well you do not have to bend that much while riding (IMO) because the front fairing (?) is rather high.. compared to the gsxr..but u own it..u’l no more!

BoOZe
Solomolo Rider

[megaspaz]

Sat on a gsx650f at bikeworld. And i don’t know, but I definately felt the weight difference just sitting on it compared to the sv650 getting it to an upright position from the kickstand. I don’t think I ever argued about the bike being good or bad, but for a beginner who just won’t do a 250, I’d definately recommend an sv650 over gsx650f just because of the weight difference… I suppose with the caveat if you weigh more than my 155lbs and are stronger than me… hahaha…

—
If there’s anything more important than my ego
around, I want it caught and shot now…

[Rab]

Rider magazine said about this bike, “If you’ve ridden one of the GSX-Rs before, you’ll feel the GSX’s extra 100-plus pounds when changing direction quickly; if not, you’re none the wiser and just forget we mentioned it here!”.

http://www.ridermagazine.com/output.cfm?id=1520209

I actually went to the dealership intent on buying a Wee Strom for my freeway commutercycle / week-end adventurer, but having sat on them both, the GSX650F just felt more comfortable. I’m getting ~52 m.p.g. on my mostly freeway commute.

Like I said, I wouldn’t recommend it as a beginner bike either, even though it’s described as an “entry level” sport bike.

[Anonymous]

That is totally the wrong way round, the CBR is the more sporty bike.

What the dealer probably did was to steer you to his excess inventory…

[Author]

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