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Forget the snow chains, what you want is one of these.

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So don’t you have a snowmobile? Those things look fantastic fun and that could be your winter bike

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I should point out David Hough was basing his statement on feedback from the MCN test riders. I think his book was cobbled together from his articles published in MCN so he probably heard firsthand from those guys. And while there is no guarantee they are expert riders, the fact they ride bikes for a living would mean they have more skills than most of us. And the ability to jump on differing bikes back to back and to a direct comparison is invaluable.

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Well I’ve got the good book in front of me and on page 119 Mr Hough tells us “in the rain, you have less total traction available for braking, but you can share the braking almost equally between front and back”. I think the theory is since you are not braking as hard (due to less traction) there is less weight transfer to the front therefore you have a more 50/50 split than in the dry.

You also goes onto claim in More PM that “It might surprise you that many cruisers and touring bikes out-stop the sportbikes”. He argues that race bikes are not designed for quick stops but for cornering quickly. I guess the short wheel base helps cornering but causes the rear to lift under heavy braking. This loss of traction means you cannot use all the power of the front brake available to you (or you would flip over).

And lastly he tells us studies like the Hurt report have shown riders in accidents made critical errors when braking. The primary sin being using too much rear brake and not enough front (this last bit is not talking about wet conditions, just in general).

Well that was a worthwhile refresher.

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Well, I don’t think any of us are pretending to be experts. Any complete beginner reading this should at least understand it is a discussion of differing opinions and take everything said with a healthy dose of skepticism.

If you reduce the variables to wet slippery road in a straight line where you need to stop as quickly as possible with a potential need to swerve, what is your best braking strategy?

I understand that cruisers are less prone to rear lock ups than sport bikes, but is the fundamental principle that most of your stopping power comes from the front different? I have never seen that so I will assume it is still true.

So I am struggling to understand your deer example. By not using the front brake you are increasing your stopping distance. By locking the rear (assuming you do) you have just increased your stopping distance even more. And once you lock it you pretty much have to keep it locked or else risk doing a Buzz Lightyear impression. The only benefit is you can still steer but I am doubtful if you could steer around said deer with a fishtailing locked rear (man, that was poetry

I honestly believe Gary would have stopped before the red light if he had used more front brake.

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By concentrating on the back brake you are giving up most of your stopping power in order to keep steering control but are almost guaranteeing a back end slide. I would prefer to stop quicker in a straight line. If I feel the need to swerve I can let go the brakes. If I don’t grab the front then I should be able to avoid a front lock up. I need to practice that more too but I would be careful about deliberately causing a front lock up. I locked mine up during my ERC and it scared the bejeebus out of me. Did not go down but it was a scary moment.

A friend of mine watched Ride Like A Pro and came away enthusing over using the back brake. I have not watched it yet but the message he took from it seemed to contradict everything else I had learned. I really need to go back to Proficient Motorcycling and see what he says about braking in the wet.

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I have not seriously looked at Aerostitch but I did come across a set of pants online that looked good until I noticed they were only 500 Denier. Equivalent Teknic pants are half the price and 600 Denier. Unless there are subtleties to the whole protection level I am not aware of then I’m not sure why the huge price difference for a seemingly inferior product. When you have a name you can add $$$ on but Teknic has a reputation for good gear at a good price, and I’ve been happy with my jacket.

If a jacket is advertised with a rain liner then I am assuming the outer shell is not waterproof. The brands that do not have a rain liner that I came across were Teknic, FirstGear and Aerostitch. Probably should look at Aerostitch in more detail.

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This raises an interesting question. Some time ago I think Elwood posted something saying in the wet you are supposed to use more rear brake than front. Something like 80/20 rear/front. I’m sure he got this from somewhere (Ride Like A Pro?) but it struck me as odd and I meant to go read up on it. Of course I never did. Personally I don’t change the proportions between front/back but I do try to give myself more time and avoid heavy braking, especially on painted lines, metal etc.

What’s your take on this?

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All RevIt gear relies on the inner layer to be waterproof, as do most brands. They claim making the outer level waterproof would reduce the breathability of the jacket. I’m sure that’s true but adding the rain layer presumably has the same affect. So now I have a jacket that cannot breath and gets soggy. What they are trying to do is make it an all season jacket. In the warmer drier months you remove the inner layer and your jacket is still comfortable. The point I was trying to make about the climate is that I have very wet winters and very dry summers. Makes no sense for me to have a jacket that tries to do both but necessarily has to compromise on each.

I actually have the RevIt Turbine jacket as my summer jacket and I like it a lot, which is why I was looking for their winter jacket. I could add the rain suit like you suggest but it comes down to practicality. I already have up to 3 layers on (an external back protector, my jacket and then a reflective bib). Adding a rain suit to this would just be a huge pain. If it was to be a once in a blue moon thing then I could live with that. But here, it’s probably more 50/50. I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve left the house and it is dry, ride a couple of miles and it is pouring. I either put the rain suit on all the time or face having to stop and put it on MANY times. Makes more sense for me for the rain suit to be part of the jacket.

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I wasn’t trying to claim the tag, that picture isn’t even mine. I was just pointing out I tried to get a picture. Up till yesterday it was only you and I playing the game. If XRayHound does not snap his picture within the next week I may be able to find another bridge next weekend. Unfortunately it is not a pretty one, a concrete monstrosity over a busy road but it does meet the requirements. I *should* be able to find that one.

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Went out to find this little puppy today..

but could not find it. I thought I had it in my GPS but did not. Turned out it was down one of many private roads and I did not want to start riding up and down them all hunting for it. The fact it was starting to snow also had some influence on my decision.

But, it did get me out and about. When I got back close to home there was blue sky so I took the opportunity to ride around some of the parks we have here (Seattle). I hit more 180′ hairpin up-hill turns today than I have on any mountain ride. I had an absolute blast. I’m going to go exploring these roads some more to see if I can put together a couple of hour ride of non-stop fun, and it’s all on my doorstep

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Sounds like you had fun. It’s always rewarding when you push your envelope that little bit further.

Interesting that you have Rev’IT pants. I was seriously considering getting myself a full Rev’It outfiit, probably the Cayenne Pro or maybe the soon to be released Sand. Went off it completely when I realized the outer layer is not waterproof. Currently my Teknic jacket is completely waterproof but I was looking to upgrade the protection level. Probably going to just stick with that as it rains a lot here in the winter so being waterproof on the outer layer is important to me. So much so I’ve now decided to get a matching pair of Teknic pants as my current Tourmaster ones absorb water like you described. I guess the climate and rainfall patterns where you live makes a difference in what gear works best for you.

I should add that the summer rainfall here is on a par with the south west i.e. not very much at all. It’s just that we get 3/4 of our annual rain in 1/4 of the year. So I need different winter and a summer outfits.

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Ah well, I had my money on her wanting an F650GS. If you haven’t watched LWR yet then it’s not too late. Even better, on Long Way Down Ewan’s wife comes out and joins them for part of the journey and you can see how much fun they had riding together. Don’t give up hope!

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So what does she want?

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Well if you want to curb her enthusiasm then Face Plant over at advrider ought to do it. If you want her to learn all the thing she needs to know then it’s the obligatory reading of Proficient Motorcycling. If you have not seen it yet then I heartily recommend the DVD of Long Way Round but that will just fire up the enthusiasm.

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