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Scooter or Motorcycle?
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January 17, 2009 at 5:28 pm #15756haakon59Participant
Good point, Sangria7, about finishing the MSF and still not being road ready–I was guessing this would be the case. I realize that learning the skills of riding is mostly a matter of practice and experience, with some pointers from the school, of course. I have been considering buying a bike first, mostly just to give myself a small amount of practice before hitting the course, but I have reconsidered and have decided not to do this based on the sound advice you and others have given me. You are right about the sales people, initially I was considering a 250cc bike but the salesperson felt 750cc’s would be OK, which took me by surprise honestly. I am guessing they themselves are so used to riding that they are not considering the needs of a beginner–after all, 750cc to them is going to be a small bike. But I also realize they are going to make more money selling me a larger, more expensive bike.
You are right about some of the reasons I am considering a scooter–stop and go traffic in the city, etc. Thanks for the advice.
January 17, 2009 at 5:40 pm #15757haakon59ParticipantBriderdt, you are right on target, this is the point I was making–it was the mindset I was thinking could be helpful. I realize I will need to work on developing the coordination to ride the bike, which will be different. I didn’t think about the wind, so thanks for mentioning this.
The throttle response on the bigger bikes I am sure is shocking when you have no experience. Knowing this will be the case in advance helps, but I think I will stick with the 250 first and gain more practice with a less powerful machine. I read some reviews of the Ninja 250 yesterday and it appears to be a nice bike, so I will have to add it to my list.
The motorcycles I have been considering mostly are either the Suzuki GZ250 or the Honda Rebel 250–obviously I am still open to considering other brands and bikes.
January 17, 2009 at 6:03 pm #15758haakon59ParticipantHere in Seattle, the International Buddy dealer is also a Ducati dealer. I visited them and talked to them, they were a very nice group of guys and I was impressed with the Buddy. That horn is suprisingly loud! After I had done some research I decided to go with 250cc or perhaps higher, if I decide to get the scooter. If I go with a motorcycle, I think I am just going to go with a 250cc bike, nothing larger.
I agree with you about the experience of the manual shift of a car–I was guessing that just having the concept down would be helpful. I actually came to prefer it but shifted to an automatic when I needed a better car for transporting people. Now that this is not a concern for me any longer, if I buy a new car again, I think I will again go with a manual transmission–if I can find one that is!
You brought up one issue I was worried about though–since you have both a scooter and a motorcycle, does your motor reaction get confused when switching between the two? I envision scenes where I apply the brakes too hard on a scooter because I thought it was a clutch, etc. Or the opposite–not remembering the back brake on the motorcycle is operated with the foot pedal instead of the left hand. I am not talking here about “normal riding” but about the quick reaction time you will need if stopping at a red light, etc. That is why this question has become important to me to sort out in advance. I am thinking I should do either one or the other and stick with that choice at least for a year or so, when I am more comfortable in traffic, etc., generally. So this is my dilemma–I share the reaction that a scooter can be more convenient for short trips in the city, but wonder if I should just go ahead and get a motorcycle so that I will develop the coordination needed for this. For me, part of my motivation is safety. No one wants to crash and I want to cut the risk by giving myself less stuff which might “confuse” my automatic reaction times. Thanks.
January 17, 2009 at 6:35 pm #15759Sangria7ParticipantDont forget they get a large sales commission selling you a bigger bike
January 17, 2009 at 6:40 pm #15760Sangria7ParticipantOnce you complete the MSF course and you start sitting on different bikes, the right bike will hit you! Its like a “DING” when you get the feel of the right bike.
January 17, 2009 at 7:03 pm #15761haakon59ParticipantThis is good to know because obviously at this point I am merely reading reviews since I have no personal experience, although I have sat on a few scooters and some motorcycles already at dealerships. But the experience of actually learning to ride will make a huge difference in my judgments, I am sure. Thanks.
January 17, 2009 at 7:12 pm #15762eonParticipantRenton Motorcycles is down by Ikea. You can also take the Evergreen MSF class there if that area is convenient for you. I hadn’t heard about University Honda closing shop. That’s too bad as they have been around in one form or another for 50 years or so (various owners) and they had a good reputation. I got good advice from them when buying a helmet and had no pressure to buy a bigger bike when they had no 250’s in stock.
I also agree that experience with a manual car will stand you in good stead. It’s not really needed for the class though as it is mainly slow speed maneuvers you will be doing. Yeah, trying to coordinate all four limbs at once is a bit tricky at first but you soon pick it up. Definitely take the class on a bike and then you can take stock and evaluate where you want to go from there.
I have no personal experience on switching from bike to scooter but have read others saying it is no big deal. The two ride so differently that the brain has no problem knowing which one it is on, in other words you still operate the correct controls instinctively. But yes, I think you would be smart to stick to one or the other for a while till you master everything else.
January 17, 2009 at 7:14 pm #15763ranetteParticipantI was also concerned about getting confused as far as the different controls on the scoot and motorcycle. I can tell you that it was not an issue and I assume that it won’t be. That being said, I haven’t been confronted with any sort of emergency/panic scenario; however, I don’t think that would change things as it’s not something I seem to have to think about. Maybe it’s because I ride both of them pretty regularly rather than riding one for a month and then the other. I know that when I got my current car, an automatic, after driving standards for the previous 8 years I kept trying to find the clutch with my left foot, but for some reason on the bikes it just seems to come naturally.
I am not trying to convince you to buy a scooter and motorcycle like I did, simply letting you know that that turned out to be an non issue for me. I went with the scooter first and think that was a good thing for me personally as it gave me a basic skill set and confidence when moving up. It does sound that at some point you’d like to have both and the one thing I would recommend is to make sure there is enough difference between your two rides. I think if you ended up with a Kymco 250 and a Ninja 250 the capabilities are similar enough that you’d end up choosing one that you preferred and neglect the other one. In my case, 150cc and 1000cc, the bikes are vastly different tools for vastly different purposes.
January 17, 2009 at 9:07 pm #15764haakon59ParticipantI know where Ikea is, so I will be able to find it, I am sure. There is an “auto row” close by, so I suppose it might be there–regardless, I will look it up. They must have a lot of bikes there because they have so many brands. It sounds like a good place to shop.
At the moment I plan to take the class on the motorcycle, although they do offer a “scooter” optional class, I talked to them over the phone. I guess the class portion is done in downtown Seattle and the practical part is in Renton, I understand.
In terms of choosing between a bike and a scooter, I think I will take the advice of many here and just get through the class first. If I pass (hopefully this will be no problem) I will have to consider if I feel comfortable enough that with some extra practice I should buy a bike or if I should just get the scooter. If I go with the bike, I will stay with that and only ride on motorcycles until I am completely used to riding in traffic and have developed some skills. Thanks for your advice.
January 18, 2009 at 2:29 am #15766MunchParticipantI would like to point out one minor thing that seems to be a constant in your posts.
You have to try and remember that your brain is a powerful tool….and weapon. If you allow “what ifs” bog you down you will be headed down a path of misery. Envisioning things to try and figure things out are great and a good way to prepare for the “just in case”….how ever the mind will take you back down the side street of “what if” and can eventually lock you down.
Slow your thoughts down a bit. Your concern and care for your safety is wonderful, however over thinking a problem and letting the imagination run wild with you can likely prevent you from something that is very enjoyable and a great escape.
In not so many courteous words….. Chest out, phone at the ear…. sign up for the MSF already!January 18, 2009 at 6:31 pm #15773haakon59ParticipantI have learned to ask questions in order to generate discussion. So far, the above posts have been extremely helpful to me–I appreciate people being willing to share their experiences, whether they are mistakes or triumphs. In general, I like hearing from people who have taken the “common paths” and also, maybe even especially, from those who have taken “different” ones. The person who posted above they had purchased a 650 (if I remember correctly, sorry, I am not looking at their post at this moment) before they took their safety class was instructive. They were able to get to work and not crash, etc., even though they were surprised about how powerful their machine was. I like this and it tells me a lot about the experiences I will soon be having. I have been able to make quite a few decisions because of the feedback I am getting. For example, I have decided not to buy a bike first, but get through the safety school before I seriously shop. It looks like it will be likely I will make it through the class just fine. Although I still might buy a scooter, I am now probably going to buy a 250cc motorcycle instead. I ask questions and learn from others so that I can avoid their mistakes (if they made any) and calibrate my expectations. Isn’t this what discussion groups are for?
January 19, 2009 at 12:30 am #15776Sangria7ParticipantYea Munch!! Gosh……
January 19, 2009 at 2:14 am #15780fl adamParticipantI went through the same thing. But do not let it worry you. The class is for beginners as I was. I worried about making mistakes, the main thing to concentrate on is to learn. I was never on a bike until I took the class, I had a great time. Am I comfortable riding in traffic, heck no. I am about to get my first bike in a couple of weeks and plan on a lot of parking lot and side road practice….
January 19, 2009 at 2:30 am #15781MunchParticipantHehe….. that’s is exactly what it is for. Another caution I was throwing out was not to let your mind defeat you before you get a chance to experience the joys of what you want to do. Riding is as much a mind set as it is physical experience. I went down the paths of “what ifs” and nearly canceled my chances of the enjoyment I am now experiencing. I remember being in the position you are in now. Should I ….. shouldn’t I…. if I do, what if I get the bike and can’t control it…. what if I become a statistic, what if I can’t get the hang of this….what if…. what if…. what if. This trickled over into my early stages of riding as well. “what if I can’t get out of my driveway with out getting run over…. What if a deer hits me or vice versa……what if I can’t ever seem to manage that curve ….What if I panic on the entrance ramp that has a near 180 turn inside of 50 feet…….” so on and so forth. I can remember my heart racing every time I got on the bike and let my mind get back on the What If train. Some times it stayed that way half way up the road. However I realized what I was doing to myself and told myself that it was very self destructive and What ifs matter as bout as much Shoulda Couldas .
I guess I should not have made it seemingly directed towards you. It is kind of a way of me saying… yea I been there and its cool but you gotta shake it off…. to anyone else in addition to you.Me …I bought my Vulcan 500 first before MSF. BBM majorly influenced my decision on the bike. Though I am mostly a hermit ( deep south country boy) and rarely get into major discussions I really didn’t look into the forums much. You have that much over me on what I had already. I rode my Vulcan 500 for about a month and a half before the next available class came up. The type of person that I am I NEED to experience it to learn it. If I read it my brain pushes it to …ok….well here’s what I would do different….and reality will kick in with a big fat “Oh REALLY! Try it!”
To be completely honest my purchase was completely spontaneous. As a matter of fact I bought the V500 three days after telling a co worker that I didn’t have the intestinal fortitude to hit the highway on a motorcycle. Guess that hit the wrong button ( or in my case the the right one) in my brain.
In ending… I apologize if I came off wrong, completely my fault.
BUT I stick to my guns…. Caution makes a person wise and safe…. What ifs will keep you from LIVINGJanuary 19, 2009 at 2:48 am #15783haakon59ParticipantThanks. I was worried a bit after I read an account by a man who failed the first and second time. My reaction was: maybe this is harder than I thought! But it sounds like most people do pass. Congratulations on getting your first bike–what size are you buying? Best of luck by the way.
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