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Riding through a locked up rear
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April 13, 2010 at 1:51 am #3869BenParticipant
So today I made yet another beginner mistake! It was raining and as most of you know I don’t have a car, only a motorcycle so that meant I had to ride to work in the morning. I was going around 40mph on surface streets when I start to approach an intersection. As I do I hear sirens and a second later a fire truck is pulling into the intersection where my light is green.
I immediately got on both brakes and started to slow down, but I must have smashed the rear one too hard because almost as soon as I started braking my rear tire locked up. I’ve had lock ups in the past but they never usually last more than 5-10 feet since they occur at the tail end of my brake period. This lockup happened at the very beginning which meant I had about 75ish feet of locked up rear to deal with.
First my rear starts to fishtail slightly to the left, then it corrects itself and fishtails more to the right, then even wider to the left again, and then again to the right. Every over-correction of the rear exacerbated the problem and made the fishtail slide out more and more. I must have looked like quite the site to the cars behind me and to the firetruck as well.
Long story short I managed to keep the bike upright (although I killed the engine in the process) and I ended up stopping in the middle of the intersection. I quickly started up my bike again and went on my merry way, albeit with a an adrenalin rush now flowing through my veins.
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So what did I learn? I’m not entirely sure. I know that I get on the rear brake too hot sometimes, in fact a lot of riders never even use it. I’ve had a couple crashes where the front has locked up (or worse, I endo!), so ever since then I’ve tried to use both brakes at once. I’ve practice panic stops in the past, but maybe it’s time to practice more.
Thankfully I always leave tons of space in front of me so I was never in any danger of hitting anyone. The odd thing was is I wasn’t too nervous while my bike was out of control. I had full gear on and I knew I wasn’t travelling ‘that’ fast (granted I did fracture my shoulder blade in an accident that was ‘only’ 30 mph). The one thing I am trying to work on is to stay loose, especially when I am in a dangerous situation. If I do crash I wand to be relaxed and roll when I hit the pavement, or at least have the presence of mind not to retain a deathgrip on the handlebars as the bike goes down.
Well that’s my story from today, near crisis diverted. Feel free to let me know if you have any comments or suggestions on what I can do better next time!
Ben
April 13, 2010 at 2:11 am #25694eonParticipantWow, exciting day for you then. I only had to deal with a Victoria Beckham lookalike tailgating me and not responding to my angry WTF glare.
Other than getting on the rear brake too hard it sounds like you did okay to me. I would suggest doing some braking practice when it is wet as it does make a difference. I also practiced braking across wet leaves which was fun (instant slide, so something to avoid like the plague).
April 13, 2010 at 3:28 am #25700IBA270ParticipantHey Ben,
Glad you’re OK and that there were no objects in your path when you entered the intersection! Here are some thoughts for you and maybe some things to work on. Some of this *may* run counter to what we teach in the BRC (and the ERC) so these are purely *MY* thoughts and not those of the MSF.
One of the things we teach at the BRC is to cover your clutch the first day, but never your brake (or brakes). The reason we do this is because nearly every new rider is going to have a panic moment and will instinctually grab and or stomp the brakes. In the real world however, the environment is no longer a “low risk learning environment”. It’s for real and treacherous. For this reason I cover my front brake and clutch with one finger always. Never my back brake. Why? Well, at least on my bikes and with my meat hook hands, I can get full if not near full braking ability WITHOUT have the power to instantly lock those powerful brakes. I cover the clutch more for comfort, but with just slight pressure I can shift up and down. Why not cover the rear? Well, we’ve all ridden as a passenger in a car when we’ve experience a situation where we “put the brakes on” on the passenger floor board. Ever noticed how hard you were pressing?
One of the reasons why the front brake isn’t located under your right foot is probably for the same reason most of us don’t sign our names with our feet: we don’t have the same dextarity nor the same “feel” that our fingers and hands have. By applying rear brake AFTER you begin to apply front, you are less likely to over apply the brakes. You will already begin to decelerate and can decide HOW much rear brake you need.
On your fishtail; you probably caused the wider gyrations in your attempt to correct, or over correct as I think you’ve recognized. Remember the rules of braking; head and eyes up, *SQUEEZE* the brakes, if the rear locks up, leave it locked (as you did). There is no turning nor correcting in braking in street applications. Remember that front braking comprises 70% *OR MORE* of your total available braking power. In situations like yours, many riders use 101% of the braking power from the rear, and maybe 50-60% of the braking power available from the front tire.
Find a parking lot and practice your quick stops using the drill you learned from the BRC. This is a GREAT drill and one that should be practiced often. This will help you better understand how much braking power you have available and just how quickly and safely you can stop. I’m betting your next quick stop will be much, much less dramatic!
I hope that helps!
April 13, 2010 at 3:55 am #25702owlieParticipantHeya, Ben!
I’m glad to hear that you came through it with little more than an adrenaline rush. What a way to start the day! I’m sure you didn’t need that first cuppa coffee when you got into the office.
The one suggestion that I will add- it drives my husband nuts, but I normally slow down as I approach intersections and only start to accelerate through after I can see that it is clear. This gives me a wider margin of error if I need to brake sharply.
April 13, 2010 at 4:28 am #25707Gary856ParticipantBraking practice is one thing, but when you add wet road and an emergency vehicle cutting into your path unexpectedly, I can see myself locking up the rear like that too. I love riding in the rain, so I need to add panic braking in the wet practice ASAP. I think panic braking practices need to be done often enough (at least once a week) or you’d loose the muscle memory.
10 days ago I locked up my rear brake going down a steep hill… 6 hours into my Saturday ride in the hills, I decided to check out a new road (Black Rd) which I haven’t ridden, on the way back. When I got to the intersection, there was a car facing me, at the stop sign, waiting to turn right on Black Rd. Not wanting to get behind that car, I turned left in front of it, and headed down Black. It was around 7:40pm, getting dark and hard to see in the twilight. I was going a little fast, wanting to stay ahead of the car, wanting to go home, feeling confident of the DRZ, but also feeling tired from being out about 6 hours by then. Black Road turned out to be quite steep, and I wasn’t riding it too well (w/ the semi-darkness and fatigue). On a steep decent, I saw a tight left hand corner coming up, and lightly applied both front and rear brakes. I felt the rear started to skid, and skid, and skid, but directional stability was still good, with just a tiny bit of slow wiggle, and felt quite controllable. I was still on the front brake and slowing down gradually, thinking, “let’s see how this skid ends”. I finally came to a controlled stop, on the shoulder at the outside bend of the turn, a few feet from a power line pole. That woke me up. Of course, when shit like this happened, I turned off the bike, parked it, to reset my brain. I walked back to check the length of the skid mark – 40 paces -> 80 ft! I touched and felt the pavement; instead of feeling rough and gritty w/ embedded pebbles, it felt smooth and glassy, as if they put a layer of sealant to smooth out the pebbles. Certainly it was a braking error on my part, but that wasn’t the best pavement for traction in a steep downhill. It wouldn’t be fun in the rain…
Before heading downhill on Black Rd, I went from a very tight road (5-30 mph), to a twisty road w/ sweepers (30-55 mph), to an even straighter road w/ high speed sweepers (45-60 mph), so I was riding progressively faster. When I turned onto Black Rd, which was very tight and steep, and the daylight was fading, immediately it didn’t feel right, but my brain was still stuck in the go-fast mode and ignored all the warning signs. That was a major mental failure.
April 13, 2010 at 4:48 am #25711Sean_DParticipantI am trying to thing about how it applies to how I brake. I know I definitely rely on my front brake 70% or more as you suggest. I tend to keep my foot off the rear brake until I feel the weight start to shift forward, then tend to apply just enough rear brake to counter the forward shift.
I have only had to make one emergency stop so far and luckily it was on dry pavement. Generally everything went well with the exception of jolt at the end. I am guessing a little too much front brake at the very end. So probably if I had to self evaluate I think I am not using enough rear brake in quick stops? I know thats the one hit I had during the MSF course as well. Did a little bit of a “stoppie” on the emergency braking from not applying enough rear brake.
April 13, 2010 at 11:02 am #25715Jeff in KentuckyParticipantIf you start on the dirt like I did, you tend to use way too much back brake and not enough front brake on pavement, and need to work on switching to more front brake and less back brake for the best stopping and settling the chassis in turns.
Some MotoGP info about back brakes:
“With the rear brake, riders have their own individual preferences, depending on how aggressively they use the rear brake. Dani Pedrosa, for example, runs a 200mm disc at the rear, while Nicky Hayden uses a 255mm disc.
This is, perhaps, a reflection of how the two riders have progressed through the ranks over the years. Pedrosa has come up from 125s and then 250s pavement racers, while Hayden is used to American dirt track racing, where bikes don’t have any brakes at the front wheel…!”
April 13, 2010 at 1:22 pm #25716IBA270ParticipantThose are good observations on riders with dirt experience; Jeff, as you know, braking principles are opposite on dirt and grass as they are on pavement. On the race track, we tend to not use the rear brake very often as we need the gyroscopic effect of the turning rear wheel for stabilization. At the end of longer, faster straightaways, some guys might use rear brake (and probably do in order to brake later). To my point of dexterity and rear braking…did you know some GP bikes have a thumb brake in lieu of a right pedal? This makes a great deal of sense to me!
Off topic: I’d REALLY like to see Nicky return to world championship form. The Ducati seems to be an absolute bear to ride…Casey being the only guy who really seems to be able to tame it, and then only for several laps (so far this year). Nicky had a GREAT ride and I think we’ll see him get faster. I’d love to see a Nicky/Ben/Collin podium at least once. In any order, how great would that be?
April 13, 2010 at 2:46 pm #25719TrialsRiderParticipant…not a frequently required concept for beginners, but:
When in a mid air jump; accelerating to spin the back wheel will cause the front wheel to rise, whereas touching the rear brake will cause the front wheel to drop. Have seen a few huge ramp jump attempts where they never seemed to clue into this fact.April 13, 2010 at 2:53 pm #25720JackTradeParticipantGlad you’re okay Ben!
I had a rear-brake-lockup situation in January. Not nearly as dramatic as Ben’s, but enough to make me think. Within 5 minutes of starting out, was heading toward an intersection at about 35 or so. Light changes to yellow right at that point of no return. I decide to brake hard, and that’s when it happened. Some fishtailing, and squealing, and finally came to a stop about 5 feet into the intersection. I was proud of myself for being able to calmly walk the bike backward out of the intersection and then wait there for the light like this was no big deal (while my heart was hammering in my chest).
Reflecting on it later, the experience definitely made me appreciate why you have to take it easy until the tires warm up, and made me pay some real attention to my braking. Shocking to the veterans here I’m sure, but I found I wasn’t really using the front brake to its full potential…I was hitting the rear fractionally first, then applying the front brake, but not really as much as I should/could.
I’ve been conscious of this since, and my braking has gotten a lot better. Can’t remember where I read it (might have been here), but something I’ve adopted is that with the front brake, when you initially apply it, you apply it to where it just starts to bite. Once you’ve made that initial contact, you then steadily and linearly squeeze to apply more pressure.
April 13, 2010 at 3:18 pm #25721eonParticipantSome interesting points being made in this thread. Interesting to hear experienced riders mention the lack of feel when braking with your foot. Having a scooter where the back brake is the left lever (same as a bicycle) I don’t have this problem just now but I am not looking forward to the day when the brake is under my right foot. I thought it was just me who thought this would result in lack of feel.
On my IRC in the braking exercises the instructor asked me if I had ABS. I thought he was taking the piss as I knew I had locked up slightly but he was being serious. Apparently I was locking in short pulses before releasing, similar to what an ABS system does. I wasn’t even really aware of doing this but I was obviously getting feedback through my fingers and reacting before my (conscious) brain even got to know about it. Hard to see this happening through a reinforced boot.
April 13, 2010 at 4:31 pm #25722eternal05Participant…but Ducati has apparently made massive changes to the bike for this year in an attempt to change the “Stoner’s bike” stereotype. They’ve put in a big-bang firing order like the Yamaha that got so much press last year, as well as made a number of other adjustments that, in net, have reduced peak power in favor of tractability. Nicky was saying in interviews that, while he finds the bike much easier to ride, he now suffers from a lack of acceleration and top speed…something which certainly wasn’t a problem on the GP09. In that last race you could see Dovi’s Honda pulling away on the main straight; they’d hit about the same speed by the end of the straight, but the Honda got there a lot faster than the Ducati every time, so I don’t know if it can be attributed to poor corner exit by Nicky.
I would love to see an all-US podium, but as much as I love Edwards, I don’t see that happening for him. Spies and Hayden? That could definitely happen, but again, I don’t know about together. That would mean a bad ride for just too many of the “aliens” to be likely. But if it does happen…oh man. Christmas in…well, not December
April 13, 2010 at 4:35 pm #25723eternal05ParticipantSomebody’s done their share of parking lot practice! Congrats.
And yes, I absolutely agree, having come from a long tradition of bicycling, that levers for braking are way better than the foot brake. Even though my nicer boots (and yours too…you have Sidis right?) are super-thin in the sole to “help give feel,” there’s only so much you can do with a piece of hard rubber. My new GSX-R rearsets are so bad that I can’t always tell when my foot first comes in contact with the rounded rubber rear brake lever. Talk about scary.
April 13, 2010 at 6:07 pm #25726eonParticipantYup, I have Sidi’s. Glad to hear they have thin soles, will help me in the transition when I finally get a real bike
I also come from a long tradition of bicycling (father was semi-professional back in the 50’s, parents met in a bicycling club), so I grew up on two wheels. That experience certainly helped in the transition to motorcycles and at least on a scooter, the braking experience is identical.
April 13, 2010 at 8:29 pm #25728Jeff in KentuckyParticipantI adjust my back brake lever lower than normal, so in a panic stop it takes me more effort to get my right toes low enough to start sliding the back tire. It helps make up for starting with 8 years on dirt bikes, where you learn that hardly any front braking equals a sliding front tire and no steering, and a good chance of crashing.
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