an expert Harley basher
April 18, 2010 at 11:01 pm #3883
from a longer article at goingfaster.com:
As Americans, we live in the greatest country, the greatest country in the entire world. We, as Americans, are driven to be the first in everything. It’s our nature. We’re not slackers. We take second best to no one. It’s a national point of pride. No one can beat our military, our pride, our technology, our determiness, or our ingenuity. There is nothing in the world, no problem, no tragedy, no foe too great that America cannot triumph over them.
So, then, I’m afraid to inform you that, in one very important regard, we ARE willing to settle for second best or even worse, last place. America has become complacent in the world, we are content to sit on our fat butts and watch others whiz past at breakneck speed and yet we do nothing. We’re getting left behind because we can’t keep up. Why? Because we are stuck in a misunderstood and ill-conceived mental rut. I’m talking about motorcycles, American made and built motorcycles; Harley Davidsons to be exact. You see them everywhere, and you know the kind of rider that is usually aboard one. Leather chaps, leather jacket, combat boots, the very epitome of a bad ass biker.
But, that’s just a wishful image. All that stuff came out of a corporate catalog… One Harley rider looks like another, pretty much, yet they all claim that they are ‘individuals’. Seeing a group of Harleys go past is like watching a cut scene from the movie “The Stepford Wives”. They’re all identical, they look alike, and they all ride the same thing; junk.
Very few Harleys are truly fast or powerful. Most are just loud rattletraps, over priced dealer wannabes or pieced together hope it works tomorrow wonders. They are paper tigers, all show and no go. You can get a hundred pounds of chrome on one of those motorcycles straight from the factory. Matching leather everything as well, even down to the little official HD logo which is oh so important to this flock behavior mindset. Studded, braided, polished, painted, chromed, but … it’s all flash. It’s all custom parts and paint, all jury rigged and low tech. In anything else but a Harley, the extremes that most Harley owners go to would be considered tacky and tasteless, and probably laughable.
The roar of a Harley is really just the growling of a sheep in wolf’s clothing, and the bleating of the image driven lemmings that ride them.
Sure, Harleys can be made to perform, but you have to rebuild them from the ground up and by the time that you get any decent performance out of a Harley, you could have bought two or three Japanese bikes.
And what about price and cost of upkeep? A top of the line Harley costs many thousands more than a comparable import motorcycle, is less dependable, doesn’t enjoy the quality or workmanship, and won’t even perform as well. It isn’t even close. So, why do so many people flock to HD dealerships and wait in line for months for a Harley? Because they are sheep. Why does a Harley hold its resale value so well when all the cards are stacked against it?
Because of one thing; image.
A underlying factor is also stupidity.
Harley Davidson’s stupidity, you ask? Hell no. Harley Davidson is about one of the smartest motorcycle manufacturers in the world. The stupidity can be traced right back to YOU, the unwitting public who buys what Milwaukee is selling and Milwaukee is selling only one thing; image. Image with no substance, image at a price. Anyone can ride a Harley, it just takes lots of money and very little brains. How else can you explain paying so much and receiving so little in return?
A Harley isn’t a motorcycle. Not a real motorcycle. It is nothing more than a rolling image, a self-propelled personal public relations machine that you rent for your ego, a facade that you strap your legs over when you want to show off to the rest of the world that you are something that you really aren’t.
“Hey! I ride a Harley! I’m bad! Don’t mess with me or you’ll be sorry!”
Whoopee. You and every other Peter Fonda Easy Rider wannabe.
How can you be bad when you don’t have any performance? How can you be bad when everything else in the world will whip your ass and hand it to you on a silver platter? How bad are you when a 250cc rice rocket will eat your 883cc Sportster for lunch? I just don’t understand the logic behind the image without any performance to back it up … It’s an empty threat. Since when did being bad mean that you got stomped by everything else in the world? I thought that being bad meant that you could take on anything and come back for more. Obviously, Milwaukee uses a different definition for the term “bad.”
A scooter will get you from point A to B, and that’s what I consider a Harley to be. A big, overpriced ego boosting scooter, geared for people too timid to make a statement to the world any other way than through noise and flash and by paying lots of money.
I don’t even consider a Harley to be an American motorcycle. It is a sad, pale product that captures very little of the American experience and doesn’t come anywhere near what a real American motorcycle should be. America stands for technology, ingenuity, performance and innovation. Harley stands for none of that. Milwaukee churns out the same tired old designs every year, a piece of this model, a piece of that model, change the tank, paint it black, add forty pounds of chrome and three grand to the price and give it a name like American Historical Limited Edition Super Extra Easy Wide Glide FGXLHR or something equally incoherent and viola!
You have a brand new Harley for this model year.
I don’t think that we’ve seen any innovation from Milwaukee for sixty years now. If Japan, Italy, and Germany did product development the same way that Harley Davidson does, there wouldn’t be Honda, Ducati, or BMW bikes. There wouldn’t be DVDs, mini-TVs, or Sony Walkmans. We’d all still be listening to wind up phonographs and watching black and white TV through vacuum tubes. And we’d be paying thousands of dollars for it and each one would be named “American Heritage Edition FGXLR TV” or something equally lame.
But they would be nostalgic.
Harleys even used Japanese carburetors on their bikes!? Why is that!? Because Japan does it better and has for a long time. The automobile industry has had to play catch up with Japan since the mid-70’s and only lately has the market gained against the wave of invasions from the Far East. Milwaukee just hasn’t seen the big picture yet. Either that, or they just aren’t smart enough to do anything about it. Or maybe Milwaukee has done all it can do, and where it can’t compete in technology and production, it chooses to supplement its income by marketing its tired old image as something ‘bad’, as ‘the American dream’, and ramming it down the throat of ignorant sheep with more money than brains.
Marketers can sell anything to anyone, all they need to do is find their target market. Harley found their target market; fools with too much money and not enough common sense. And Milwaukee is milking it dry for all they can grab.
Performance and technology; two words synonymous with America. What does America have to show the rest of the world with regard to performance and technology? America is at the top of the world for everything that is powerful, compact, and fast, from military vehicles to hand held computers to fighter jets. We put a man on the moon, we have the space shuttle, and we invented nuclear weapons and nuclear power. Everything that is performance oriented, everything that is leading edge, America has a stake in it. Everything in America is fast and powerful and has the brass to back it up anytime a challenge is made. Everything we build commands respect with the rest of the world.
Everything except American motorcycles. When you add Harley Davidson to that lineup above, it just kind of seems anti-climatic doesn’t it. It’s misplaced. So, where is America’s most powerful motorcycle? Where are the muscle machines that we, as Americans, crave and love so dearly? America doesn’t have one. America doesn’t build a single high performance motorcycle. Not one. [The V-Rod will beat a Yamaha Road Star Warrior in a straight line, but costs more and does not corner as well.]
Once you crank your Harley engine, you aren’t going to change one bit, except that you will have become a slave to the media, you will have allowed yourself to willingly accept a brand association, and you will have admitted that you’re a gullible fool who doesn’t know the first thing about what a REAL motorcycle is.
Simply put, a Harley is God’s way of saying that you have too much money and not enough brains.
I’m as patriotic as the next guy, but I believe in a different kind of motorcycle for America. I believe in a true, high performance motorcycle that is American designed, built, and ridden. I believe in more than Harley Davidson, I believe in something that Harley is missing out on. I believe in American dominance over every other type and brand of motorcycle in the world. That is what America is all about, showing the rest of the world how it’s done and then letting them play catch up. That’s dominance gained by performance, power, and design. Not image, loudness, and the flash of chrome off of oiled leather. Dominance gained through legitimate means instead of smoke and mirrors, dominance gained through sheer power, skill and determination. Dominance gained through technological advantage and design.
The rest of the world left Milwaukee behind, and it happened sometime in the late ’60s when Harley Davidson started losing races to British and Japanese motorcycles. What did Harley do? Did they jump into research and catch up to the foreign invaders? Did they pick up the down trodden American flag and raise it high into the air again, waving it proudly in victory? When the chips were down, did they muster all that they had, pick up the pieces, and come from behind to capture the winner’s cup in grand American tradition.
Harley did what no American would ever consider doing… They quit.
Harley gave up. They quit racing. When their bubble was burst, and new and faster motorcycles were entering the market, Harley simply walked away and never went racing again. Harley left the real world and gave the go ahead to European and Japanese manufacturers that America was out of the performance circle and that America was out of the game. Soon what the British and Japanese engineers were learning at the race tracks, they were applying to their brands of motorcycles, making them faster, better handlers, lighter, more durable, more reliable. Their technology was advancing by the year, with each victory, with each innovation, each design breakthrough.
Harley walked back to it’s little corner of the world (Milwaukee, USA), with it’s tail between its legs and sulked. It just wasn’t fair that all those mean old import bikes would beat up on something American. It just wasn’t (sniff, sniff), fair, darn it. So, Milwaukee took their toys and left. As the world passed Harley Davidson by, Harley just kept on beating out the same old tired, uninventive, unimaginative designs year after year like their pappy had done before them, and their grandpappy had done before that.
Oh, Harley could have been a dominant force in the world market, far more than they are today, but they quit. Yes, they just quit. And now they are so far behind, that America may never catch up in performance motorcycles, especially not if we have to rely on quitters like Milwaukee to heed our call for capable machines in the great international motorcycle wars.
I really get tired of people coming up to me and saying “You need to get a real bike. You need to ride a Harley, not some damn rice burner!”
Most of the people who tell me that don’t even own a motorcycle, let alone a Harley! They’re just good old boys or girls who have this ignorant notion that no motorcycle in the world is better than a Harley and since I am an American, I should be ashamed to ride anything that isn’t American. Here’s a shock, Sparky. Did you know that America has several really fast motorcycle racers to be proud of? Nicky Hayden and Ben Spies immediately stand out. Did they ride domestic speed horses? No. We, as Americans, couldn’t offer them a bike to ride on that would be competitive with European and Japanese models. That’s a shame, home grown racesr having to sign up with European and Japanese corporations for a chance to gain glory for America. I blame Milwaukee for that, I blame the three tooth hill scoggins that work at Harley Davidson banging out the same old tired designs and who are content to sell more merchandise than actual bikes for that kind of embarrassment. Hayden gained an impressive amount of glory for America riding Hondas. Not Harleys or Buells! An American out there showing the world what America was made of and he was doing it on a Japanese bike! Now folks, that is downright embarrassing from a patriotic point of view.
Milwaukee, you should hang your head in shame for letting down the American people the way that you have. How could you do it? Or better yet, explain to me how you could fool the whole country into believing that it was okay to quit and that you are still the number one motorcycle maker in the world. As Motorhead’s song goes; “Don’t talk to me, I don’t believe a word”.
God bless Eric Buell, for being fired by Harley Davidson and attempt to design a true American sports bike, with a rotax water cooled engine from Austria. He saw what America needed to be competitive again and he didn’t find it in Milwaukee. He had the right idea, HD is stagnant. Their latest designs still look like they were created at the end of WW II. No innovation, and why should there be. If lazy Americans will buy cobbled together rattle traps at super premium prices, why should you change the design. If fools out there will buy quartz at diamond prices, then there will always be someone out there to make a killing off of selling quartz. If America is willing to buy an image, then Milwaukee is selling. They’ve got a gravy train just waiting for the next sucker with more money than common sense to buy one of their products. Harley makes more money on T-shirts and HD embossed leather wallets on a chain than from selling motorcycles. Big hint here, folks. It’s all about image.
It sure isn’t about performance, America, or glory. It’s all about a canned and commercially available image. You subscribe to it with each T-shirt or accessory that you buy. That’s sad, but it is another example of image and the power of the media. How many people out there have a HD emblem sticker in their truck window but don’t own a HD? How many people have a HD T-shirt, but don’t own the motorcycle?
People tell me that when I bought my Ninja that I was supporting Japan’s economy when I should have been supporting America’s economy. I didn’t see it that way. I saw it as a way of sending a message to Milwaukee. That message is that I can buy a much better built, faster, better handling bike cheaper than anything you produce any day of the week. I’m making a statement. Wake up Milwaukee! This Ninja is the bike that I and countless other red blooded American youths want to own, and you don’t make it!
You don’t even come close.
You don’t stand for youth, you stand for old age and mediocrity. You stand for slow and weak when we want fast and powerful! Who do we turn to? Those who can make and sell what we want! Hear this, Milwaukee? If you made a decent sport bike like the Japanese and Italians, those of us who live in America and ride CBRs and Ninjasand GSXRs would probably buy it, if it was just as fast, reliable, and affordable as those that Japan offers.
So you bought a Harley? Congratulations. That was about the most unpatriotic thing that you could have done. Why? Because you’re helping to support a facade. You aren’t doing America any good because you’re sending Milwaukee a message that what they are building is just fine. You’ve been sending that message for a long time now and Milwaukee is reading it loud and clear. It’s time we weed out the dead wood and start over. It’s time that we sent Milwaukee a new message. We want real motorcycles, not the crap you are cranking out. Catch up or get out of the market because America won’t tolerate quitters any more. We want real bikes like the rest of the world produces. We want to be number one again and we won’t take second place as an option.
We don’t build anything else, just twins. No straight fours, no V-fours, no singles, nothing. Just old, outdated twins that have been around since before World War II.
Instead of trying to come up with something on their own, Harley had to turn to the Germans for the V-Rod engine!? There goes American ingenuity for you, guess you can say that Milwaukee has no new thinking, they have to get it from out of country.
If I had been Harley, I would have gotten together with Chevrolet in order to design an ultra compact, multi-valve liquid cooled four cylinder. Think of it, Harley and Chevrolet building American sport bikes, standards, and cruisers. You want foreign technology, Milwaukee? Chevrolet bought out Lotus, that’s how they got thirty-two valves in their 350cid Corvette ZR-1! Even if Chevrolet doesn’t have Lotus anymore, they probably still have a good understanding of multi-valve engines. Why Porsche instead of Chevrolet? Why did an American company like Harley, whose riders blatantly display hatred of all motorcycles foreign or Japanese, turn to a foreign company for help? Why didn’t Harley turn inwards to within America’s own technological base for help?
So you bought a Harley? Congratulations on helping to keep the American dream dormant and to support an image without substance. But, wait, you say, I didn’t buy my Harley to race (that’s fairly obvious). I bought it to ride. I bought it for the freedom of the open road and to travel. I bought it to enjoy the adventure that is motorcycling, “Where the Road Begins And Never Ends…”(tm).
Oh, brother. What a bunch of stupid commercial driven trend humping NASCAR following redneck lemmings… You just paid a butt-load of money for the world’s worst accelerating, worst handling, worst braking, heaviest, loudest, and ugliest motorcycle.
Wake up, you bunch of image driven lemmings! When you turn that key in your new or used Harley, you don’t turn into the Incredible Hulk, you stay the same old boring accountant who works from eight to five in a cubicle. So you ride a Harley. Big deal. The truth? Can you handle it? You bought into an image. An image fabricated by countless TV shows and Hollywood movies depicting a life on the back of a bike that you simply weren’t cut out for. You WISH you could be like Lorenzo Llamas in that lame TV series, RENEGADE. You wish you were riding a customized Harley and being a bad ass.
But you aren’t.
You WISH you could be like Peter Fonda as “Captain America” and Dennis Hopper as “Billy” in EASY RIDER, cruising America doing whatever you want, being bad and breaking the law.
But you can’t.
It’s all make believe and you just bought a make believe motorcycle.
If someone out there is reading this, and you have more money than you know what to do with (multi-millionaires or billionaires only, I’m afraid, because this is going to take a lot of money), and you are wanting to do something that other people around the world will remember your name for ages to come, here’s a simple solution.
BUY Eric Buell. That’s right, walk straight up to Eric Buell, hand him a LARGE sum of cash, and say, “You work for me now. We’re going to build real American bikes!” Watch, he’ll follow you around where ever you go and the first place that you need to take him to is the site where you’re going to break ground for the new Buell American Motorcycle Corporation (BAMC) building and assembly plant. This will be built by you, or you and a group of investors, to churn out the highest tech motorcycles that the world has ever seen. Motorcycles that the Japanese will work day and night to overcome. Motorcycles that are American designed and built. Powered by the highest technology engines that Americans can produce. Motorcycles that look nothing like what Milwaukee produces. You’ll get the best designers that money can buy, smart kids, who aren’t afraid to try radical designs and building techniques, who know how to compete with the rest of the world. Fresh ideas, not rehashed stale old technology thrown together in yet another uninspired combination for this years model. You’ll have design teams, not cousins and uncles and brothers all with the same last name and one good set of teeth between them. You won’t build ‘motorcycles like pappy used to build ’em.’
Think of it!
Bikes that look like they came right out of Akira, or Blade Runner, instead of machines that look like they were picked up at a Allies post war auction. American super bikes and super cruisers that would dominate the world. Engines from 250cc up to 1500ccs. Fours, sixes, twins! Fuel injection! Twin engines! Turbo charged and intercooled! Carburetors by Rochester! Supercharged! Not American Iron anymore, but American alloy, aluminum, titanium, and other exotics, mass produced and affordable to those who are dying to ride what America so desperately needs; a true home built performance bike.
America could build V-4s and conquer the world motorcycle market. Why stop there? We could build V6s and V8s, we’re really good at building V8s! How about a fuel injected V8 powered American built, American designed, super sport bike? I’m not talking about taking a Harley and plugging a small block Chevy in it either! I’m talking about a 600cc V8 with ram air and fuel injection. How about a American Standard powered by the same engine, much like Yamaha’s VMAX?
We INVENTED the technique in the 1960’s and 1970’s on our muscle cars! We would start to build what Americans build best; hotrods and fast bikes. You’d see them on the global tracks, you’d have racers running from other corporations for a chance to ride on your team, and they would be riding REAL bikes, not some leather saddle tassel covered sofa on wheels. No! We’re talking about American made engines, liquid cooled, with double overhead cams, four and five and six valves per cylinder, aluminum engine blocks and heads, carbon fiber body parts and fuel tanks, aluminum wheels and twin spar reinforced frames. Exotic materials mass produced at quantities that would make them competitive with Japanese imports. We would come up from behind Japan and Europe, hop on their shoulders, and grab first place, never looking back.
Real American motorcycles that would look American! No more retro 1940’s look, but modern, CAD designed stream lined dreams that would prowl the streets of the world, proclaiming that once again, America was the power to be reckoned with. They would be light, powerful, and since they would be mass produced, they would be affordable, as affordable as the Japanese imports. Let those wannabes who want tassels and a leather fetish go to Milwaukee. Those of us who crave a real American bike could walk into a Buell or Chevy dealership and take our choice of new American standards, cruisers, tourers, sport-tourers, and sport bikes. We could even have factory designed accessories! Racing leathers, helmets, decals, etc.
Money out the wazoo from patriotic young Americans who would have a motorcycle to be proud of! Do you realize how much money is involved in aftermarket paraphernalia? Well, I guess if you are Harley Davidson, you really do understand.
What image comes to mind when you think Harley?
Power? Nope. Handling? Nope. Well educated owner? Nope. Member of society riding it? Nope. See one parked outside the Country Club? Nope. See a Harley on the race track? Nope. These are the images that come to mind when I think of a Harley: Redneck, trailer park, cheap beer, truck stops, bad country music, pickup trucks, tattoos up one arm and down the other, leather wallet on a chain, Rottweilers as pets, German W.W.II helmet with the spike on top, murals on the tank, trailer parks, Grim Reaper, uncut beard, Hell’s Angels, Nazis, smoke filled bars, knife hidden in the boot, American flag bandanna, huge belt buckle, leather saddlebags, tassels, wannabe rider. Everything that motorcycles are not supposed to stand for.
The target buyer for Harley Davidson, if I read their ads correctly, are male overweight, middle aged, sexually repressed ex-cons with an abundance of tattoos, body and facial hair, and odious personal habits. They also tend to have a severe leather fetish with a passion for chains, tassels, and metal studs.
So, what does that make Harley Davidson? A Harley is the world’s best selling motorized wheelchair for hippies and wannabes, and for those who would rather buy a reputation than earn one.
These are just my opinions, but it explains why I don’t like Harleys. I don’t think that a Harley is an American bike. America stands for power, and that power is always bundled in fast, sleek, and innovative cutting edge packages. Harley stands for none of that, and it hasn’t for about fifty years now.
So, where does that leave Harley Davidson. You can paint as many American flags as you want on the gas tanks or the helmets, but it still doesn’t change what Milwaukee can’t do. Milwaukee can’t lead America in competition with the rest of the world. Until America builds real bikes, Americans will buy their real bikes from Japan and Italy and Germany.
I think I’ve finally figured out just *WHY* Harley Davidson motorcycles are so popular… Harley Davidson isn’t a motorcycle company, it is a cult religion. You don’t ride a Harley Davidson so much as you worship it. You and every other little acolyte. A Harley Davidson is a rolling altar to mediocrity, you bend your knees and you pray to a pagan idol of chrome and leather for the pitiful life that you glean from it. That is the only way that I can see why so many people are so clueless when it comes to motorcycles. They can’t stand on their own, they aren’t tough enough to be individuals, so they have to reinforce their own self image with artificial constructs.
Harley Davidson. It’s not a motorcycle company. It is a pagan cult religion for brain dead trend humping fashion lemmings.April 19, 2010 at 1:19 pm #25830MunchParticipant
You really needed to go there? A few changes to some words and the same can be said about any bike company.April 19, 2010 at 2:42 pm #25831eonParticipant
Why are you posting someone elses rant? There may be some merit to some of the argument, but it is still just a rant. If this is what you believe then you would make this board a more interesting place if you put this in your own words and argued your case. Just copying/pasting it makes it appear you are trolling for reactions.
You seem to do a lot of linking to other articles. I would like to hear more about you and your experiences. That’s what makes this forum interesting I think, having a healthy discussion on motorcycle topics where not everyone is always in agreement but are always respectful of others point of view. Having BBM as a catalog of links to other websites would make make it a very stale place I think.April 19, 2010 at 5:21 pm #25838SantaCruzRiderParticipant
So the guy doesn’t “get” the attraction of Harley — so what. This kind of rant comes from folks with way too much time on their hands and a hugely over-inflated opinion of their own opinion. Here’s a guy so in love with the smell of his own flatulence that he’s compelled to share it with the rest of us. It’s sad.April 19, 2010 at 6:46 pm #25841
The bike is just the tool; the rider is the artist. I know harely riders that can (and do) embarass sport bike and touring folks all the time. I know a guy who rode his harley 100K miles. In one year. Not sure why anyone would waste that much time bashing people who enjoy the same sport as the author did. It’s not helpful when our rights as riders of motorcycles (any make or model) is continually under attack by those who do not ride and do not understand.
Instead of trying to appreciate all types of riders and subcultures, and recognize that each of our little corners of our own little motorcycle worlds are filled with “bad apples” or challenges, this person throws a rock at the very glass house where he/she sleeps.
Sad. I spend too much time even commenting about this.April 19, 2010 at 10:02 pm #25850owlieParticipant
+1 to Munch: The V-Star marketing material is particular leverages the same image.
+1 to Eon: I couldn’t agree more.
For myself: Just because you don’t like cruisers or the cruiser image, it doesn’t mean that it is bad, wrong, or unAmerican. Most of the same arguments can be turned around to other groups in the biking community.April 19, 2010 at 10:04 pm #25851
If this guy steers one person new to motorcycles away from a Harley Davidson, he may save a life. They are not designed for most beginners because of their weight. Some think it is fine for Harley owners and nonowners to bash other brands as “unpatriotic”, while at the same time supposedly supporting free market competition-
I found this an interesting point of view, and I share many of the opinions myself, even though my first motorcycle riding on other than a minibike was a 60cc bike imported from Italy by Harley Davidson in the 1960s. All of the millions of people worldwide who bought a brand other than a Harley had their reasons, and this guy clearly explained his.
The title clearly stated what the article was about and included the word “bashing”- my advice is if you are not interested in a topic after reading the title, then do not bother reading the article.
If someone has a reason for not liking or for liking any motorcycle brand, and they choose to take the time to post it, either original writing or something they have seen elsewhere, I am happy to see it. I previously posted a link to a review that included info about Suzuki having warranty problems for several of the Suzuki bikes he had bought over the years, and several people have written about the poor quality of Chinese made bikes, but no one made a big fuss about it.April 19, 2010 at 10:44 pm #25853JackTradeParticipant
I wonder though if beginners have to get steered toward the “wrong” bike (would that this wouldn’t happen, but you know how we are here in the U.S.), if it’s not better they get steered to a heavy, relatively slow cruiser, rather than a superlight, superpowerful sportbike.
That said, what strikes me as odd about the article is that for all its talk about competitiveness and the market, the author doesn’t seem to see that when it comes to HD, the market IS working.
HD’s not tricking people into buying their bikes…people are seeking them out…otherwise, HD would be out of business.
Seems like what the author is mostly upset with is other people’s preferences.April 19, 2010 at 11:42 pm #25858
From the original article:
“Harley Davidson is about one of the smartest motorcycle manufacturers in the world. The stupidity can be traced right back to YOU, the unwitting public who buys what Milwaukee is selling and Milwaukee is selling only one thing; image. Image with no substance, image at a price. Anyone can ride a Harley, it just takes lots of money and very little brains. How else can you explain paying so much and receiving so little in return?”April 20, 2010 at 2:17 pm #25870MunchParticipant
Again…. really? Since your keen on drawing up other articles….. I have a sport bike magazine that touches on selling images …guess what other names pops up….Ducati and Triumph. All three companies have come to understand that if you market your product as just a mode of transportation your sales are gonna suck…. Suzuki is a great example. This year they delayed their 2010 line up due to lagging sales and over inflated stock. Where Ducati, Triumph and HD have all kept their losses to a minimum by selling a lifestyle along with good bikes.
My exceptions come into play when a person places an ignorant judgment on a group of people based on stereotyping and, well for the literal definition of ignorant….lack of information. Wether they be Sport Bike riders, Touring riders, Motocross or cruiser types we all are part of the same community and since the majority of the caged population are not keen on looking out for us to avoid us we all ought to be looking out for each other.
Each bike manu has it’s own niche in the “price inflation” market. Wether or not your willing to pay 14 grand for a repli racer or for a chromed out Fat Boy is purely a decision left to the owner. Public opinion be damned. Progress in designs have been improved on all styles of bikes… wether it be a reverse piston design on the latest Sport Bike or the New V4’s that Honda and Aprilla are revisiting or the more rigid frame on the newest Harley Davidson’s…oh yea and they have worked on the motors to. Your money, your decision. We all are on 2 wheels….. get over it and move on.April 20, 2010 at 3:07 pm #25867ShamRock229Participant
Touche good sir, you just earned 10 man points!April 20, 2010 at 3:12 pm #25868
I gotta agree with Munch…I absolutely, wholeheartedly disagree with the author’s assertation, and find it somewhat offensive. If I were a rider of Harley Davidsons, I’d REALLY find this knuckle head (pun intended) offensive!
There is nothing but pure conjecture in the entire article. It’s just one man’s (ill informed) opinion. I find HD’s interesting machines from an engineering stand point. If anyone knows anything about radial aircraft engines, then they probably find HD’s rather appealing. The have a strong tie-back to their early heritage, and I understand why people find this so appealing. Besides, on of Ducati’s BEST SELLING engine models…is based on a 1980 model. In fact, I’m pretty sure the barrels, heads and lower end all interchange. How about that for “paying much and getting little”.
I just don’t see the reason for the drivel here. Leave the BS that some ignoramous posts on another site…on the other site.April 20, 2010 at 3:24 pm #25871
The author says “You can paint as many American flags as you want on the gas tanks or the helmets, but it still doesn’t change what Milwaukee can’t do. Milwaukee can’t lead America in competition with the rest of the world. Until America builds real bikes, Americans will buy their real bikes from Japan and Italy and Germany.”
HD’s aren’t real bikes? Hmmm. They’ve all felt real to me, but what do I know?
HD outsells all manufactures from Germany and Italy. Combined. Many times over…
HD is not the top selling brand, Honda is. HD also only sells two types of motorcycles; standards and touring bikes, both in the larger displacement catagory. That puts HD in a solid…get this…second position.April 20, 2010 at 3:45 pm #25872TrialsRiderParticipant
HDMC started making the best motorcycle in the world the moment they bought MVAG !:i … too bad they are divesting it.April 20, 2010 at 5:42 pm #25873
Yea, that’s a sad deal. I had hoped that cash infusion for MV, plus some technical pieces from them would have made a difference for both parties. Dammit.
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