Being seen by motorists

in

I'm new to motorcycling, just getting started. But for some reason I've always been really conscientious about looking out for motorcyclists on the road (probably the secret desire I've been harboring all these years to actually become one). I've always somehow been good at spotting motorcycles early in my mirrors, and because they can go faster and fit into gaps cars can't, I always give them plenty of room to get by too.

Well, now it's happening, I'm getting my first motorcycle (decided on a Yamaha XV250) and suddenly I'm all too aware of the fact that not every motorist out there is 'bike conscious'. It seems to me that the main thing is getting seen in the first place. Blind spots on cars, especially in rear view mirrors can effectively make a rider invisible.

Other than the obvious 'keeping off the white lines' does anyone out there have any tricks up their sleeves on how to get noticed by car drivers and generally stay out of trouble where idiot drivers are concerned. BTW, they let 15 year olds drive cars here in New Zealand.

Jules

Bright colored gear,

Munch's picture

Bright colored gear, reflective gear, making sure you can see the persons face in their mirrors and YOU are watching for them.....not the other way around. Don't linger in any potential blind spots if at all possible.
Some non popular advice.... lighting extending away from the slender frame of the bike. Make the driver question whats coming up on him/her. Or.... on the rear of your bike for the same effect when they come up on you. Local laws would dictate wether you can have a brake light that pulses when the brakes are applied. Always ride like you are invisible...and above all else:

TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR ACTIONS.

It's not always their fault nor their responsibility to see you. It is your responsibility to make yourself seen, heard, waved at, laughed at, winked at, and whatever else you can think of...and even then...don't assume it was you they were waving at. If you aren't sure every effort you made was successful....get out of their way..they win...they are bigger and will survive.... your chances are less then theirs in a push and shove match. Let it go and move on, live on, RIDE ON!!!

****Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but, rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy Shit....What a ride!!!"****

Advice from an idiot driver

SantaCruzRider's picture

Adding to what Munch said: My advice is to separate yourself from thinking that riding a bike is more than about 20% similar to driving a car.
In a car, I can be reasonably sure that I can occupy a lane and if I avoid slamming my brakes or jamming on the gas, most drivers will be able to see me and keep track of me well enough so that when it come time for them to change lanes, they won't collide with me. And if they do, it will typically be in a manner that will result in some swearing, an exchange in information and me being late for work.
NOTE: This bears NO resemblance to how it would work if you are on a bike. On a bike, you are navigating between kill zones. Even on a 2-lane road, you should consider your passes. If I'm in the fast lane, I never crawl past the car on the right. Instead, I sit back of his left quarter until I think he's seen me and then when I think it's clear, I accelerate up until I'm at least even with his driver mirror and am sure he's seen me. Until them, "I'm invisible" to him.
Another tip: Use all the lane to make yourself visible. This may involve claiming territory by riding the middle when your lane is moving faster than others, riding the fender of someone who seems to want to cut in, or just weaving a bit as traffic slows and you want to be sure folks see you.
Also, accept that you are harder to see and ride with that in mind. I've ridden for years, and I still get caught when I'm in my car and suddenly a biker is up on my mirror slicing through the spot that I was just eyeing for my car lane change. Truly, it freaks me out because I'm very conscious of bikes and then I see how invisible they are even to me and I wonder if my life hangs in such a small balance.
Personally, I believe in riding very "activily" (I'd say aggressively, but I DON'T mean fast or reckless).
Lastly, if you want to be visible but don't want to wear dayglow, try to emulate the local LEO. I ride an old school bike similar to one ridden by LEO, helmet is silver (like CHP), black jacket -- net result is that when someone glances back and sees you, they keep track of you, rather than ignoring you.
Hope that helps

assume nothing

TrialsRider's picture

I've been rear ended in the middle of a traffic intersection, just for not driving as aggressive as the commuter behind expected. On a recent occasion, I narrowly avoided being taken out by an older lady driving out of a shopping mall parking lot, impressionable because without a doubt she made eye to eye contact with me the whole time she was doing it ! ...I don't think she was intentionally attempting vehicular manslaughter, It was more like, she was mesmerized by my bright red bike or somethin. I call it, fly at the light bulb syndrome.
Had many more close calls and bad experiences, but enough of that stuff, if you ride as long as I have, it's going to be that way. Motorcycles have provided the best times in my entire life, don't let anything turn you off riding.
Great news is; motorcycles are fantastic for accident avoidance, they will brake faster, turn tighter, accelerate faster and occupy a smaller space than anything else on the road, so stay on track with everything your OP says, develop those cat like reflexes and don't let em' run you down.

Similar...

JackTrade's picture

...to what SantaCruzRider says about looking like an LEO, a simple one:

Wear a light-colored helmet.

While they're sometimes hard to find these days, wearing a white, or red, etc. helmet rather than a dark one goes a long way toward helping other motorists see you. It's the highest point on you, and people's eyes are definitely drawn to it.

I don't know if solid color ones are more visible than the racing-inspired multi-colored ones, but I think either is a good for increased visibility.

On Helmets

@JackTrade and SantaCruzRider,

Thanks for the advice on helmets. Had my eye on a nice cool black one, but your advice makes sense, and I want to be seen. Red or white sounds like a great idea. Love the 'look like a LEO' idea. Unfortunately CHP gear is a lot cooler than NZ highway patrol. I'm not an especially image conscious person, but this is not a good look...

Photobucket

Hilarious

SantaCruzRider's picture

Looks like the circus has come to town.

Some (very) unscientific

eon's picture

Some (very) unscientific tests have shown that motorists are as blind to hi-viz riders as to non hi-viz but are remarkably good at spotting you if you look like a cop. Something to do with threat detection. In other words, they do see you but dismiss you as not relevant to them. Important to realize this is not people being dumb asses but it's just the way our brains are wired.

Other unscientific tests have shown that deliberately looking like a cop will result in some unfriendly attention from the real deal. Try putting some blue lights on the front of your bike and see how you get on (even when it is legal).

Having said all that I tend towards the h-viz end of the spectrum and solid colored helmets. My 2nd helmet has a fancy paint scheme and I regret not getting the solid white one (it was $60 more for solid white!) after following a group of riders in low light conditions. The guy with the white helmet stood out while the others disappeared into the background.

Google SMIDSY for some other light reading. There is another theory that some horizontal movement greatly enhances the chances the other person will see you (I'm thinking someone sitting at a junction you are approaching looking right at you). It's something I practice all the time whenever I see someone is waiting to cross over my lane.

I do all I can to be visible but you have to remember it is just your first line of defense. I would say it is more important to ride defensively and there are all kinds of strategies for that (a few of which have been mentioned here already). Grab yourself a copy of Proficient Motorcycling if you have not already. That is a great book for identifying the dangers you will face and how to recognize and avoid them before it becomes painful.

Proficient Motorcycling

Thanks for the tips and the book suggestion eon. I'll pick that up. What do you mean by 'horizontal movement' though?

From head on a motorbike has

eon's picture

From head on a motorbike has a pretty small profile. If that bike is heading directly towards you it is going to get bigger only slowly, which makes it difficult for our brains to pick it out of the cluttered background behind it. Studies have shown that our eyes are good at picking out movement. So if that bike was to move relative to the background behind it, our eyes pick it up in an instant. So weaving slightly in your lane moves you across the car drivers horizontal (or lateral) field of view and makes you immediately more visible to them. The same thing happens if you are not moving, the car driver does not see you and starts to pull out. At that point you are moving relative to the background and suddenly they see you and hit the brakes. This is why you should never assume even if the car driver is looking straight at you that they actually see you. There is a well worn excuse after an accident of "Sorry mate I didn't see you" (SMIDSY for short). Sometimes they are telling the truth.

So if you can, a gently weave AWAY from the car increases your chances of being seen. If you move towards them you are getting closer to a 90' angle of attack which would make you less visible. Plus moving away also gives you more room if you need to take avoiding action.

Gotcha

Thanks Eon, got what you mean now. I was think a modest bit of weaving might be a good idea.

I've also read that movement is a fundamental feature of vision. Without it our attention isn't attracted in the first place. An interesting study I read about (by Francis Crick, one of the guys who discovered the double helix DNA molecule) showed that the human eye can track a moving object perfectly across any background. But it cannot smoothly scan across plain one. Instead the eyes unconsciously jump from spot to spot along the line of the scan. That's probably what's happening with SMIDSY's. No movement means the eye jumps, missing the apparently motionless motorcyclist. Great advice for a newbie like me. Thanks!

My Gear is very similar to Eon's avatar...

Sean_D's picture

... in that I generally wear a black and yellow jacket with a bright helmet. Solid yellow in my case. Your helmet is your highest and most visible point in traffic. My wife has followed me and says she can easily pick me out in traffic because of the bright yellow helmet. White and Silver also work well.

I am also a bit of a safety geek I suppose, but I do wear one of those bright vests. If people notice the vest and think it looks stupid then so be it. They had to notice me to think that. Besides, the thing lights up like the Vegas strip when headlights hit it. Here are some Hi-Vis tips along with a "score sheet." I will have 10 out of 10 covered once I add the auxiliary lights hehe.
http://www.motorcyclesafety.state.mn.us/latest/MMSCHomeSecondary.asp?cid...

Adding to the gear I have placed reflective Solas stickers on the Helmet and tape my bike frame to increase visibility at night. The frame on my bike is black so I have used the black tape. It is barely visible during the day, but reflects brightly when headlights hit it. I have placed this one the forks and a couple other areas to increase side visibility at night. The reflective helmet stickers I have placed front, back and sides. Some I got from here... http://www.nightfirepatches.com/Decals.html

I do always pulse my brakes to grab attention, but I have also added a Kissan license plate frame. In addition to having redundant turn signals in the form of progressive LED's (5 LED's for each direction) it also has a modulated brake light in the center. http://tinyurl.com/y8fwenx

I changed my headlight out for one of the PIAA Plasma bulbs. Sort of a bright white with a purplish hue similar to the HID lights. Watching oncoming traffic, even in the day, I find I always pick out those purple/white HID headlights out of the crowd of more yellow and white of the standard headlights.

I am going to add some additional lights to the front as I only have the headlight. From what I gather the human eye requires more than one source of light to properly triangulate speed and distance. I am also considering adding a headlight modulator and bar-end turn signals.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

Not keen on modulators

Rab's picture

All very good ideas, but I'd be wary about the headlight modulator.

I commuted with one for a while and here in California, it was great for lane-splitting (was like Moses parting the Red Sea), however, on more than a couple of occasions, I'm convinced that some drivers, catching a momentary glimpse of the flashing headlamp, thought I was signaling them to pull out in front of me; regardless of how impractical it was at those speeds.

I eventually took it off and now ride with full beam during the day.

Hmmm.. food for thought on the modulator

Sean_D's picture

Every time I see one on the the road I spot them waaay down the road, so they definitely seem to work in that regard. But I can see the point you bring up about how they could possible be dangerous in certain situations. Wonder if there is any way to rig one enable and disable it when necessary? Probably not be the nature of how they work.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

Headlamp Modulators

Rab's picture

I thought about doing the same thing but never got around to trying it out.

As I understand it, to be legal, they have to flash at a certain rate and have to have a photo-electric switch which disables the flashing at night. Additionally though, like you said, it would be nice to have a switch so that you could manually over-ride this default day/night behavior.

Like I said, for lane-splitting, it was great as they probably thought I was a cop; woe betide any other motorcyclist lane-splitting in another lane though as they could quite easily have been knocked-of as the car drivers swerved out of my way. That said, most seasoned motorcyclists here in California know that you should really only be lane-splitting in the left-most "lane" or working your way over there to lane-split.

You are correct about flashing and there are a few more reg...

Sean_D's picture

WebBike World published the regs for modulators http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-technical-articles/Modulator-regs...

I would assume the current models would have to comply if they are from a reputable company. So I am thinking since section (e) states: Means shall be provided so that both the lower beam and upper beam remain operable in the event of a modulator failure. There should be a way to bypass the modulator so that the system faults to a "fail" state and both the high beam and low beam operate as normal.

So my bike has a cover for a dummy switch for the headlight. I would like to order one of the Euro Spec switches to replace the blank plate and wire the modulator to be able to bypass it at will.

I think I am going to write to a few of the companies and get their feedback on that as a solution.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

Side-by-side lane splitting

SantaCruzRider's picture

Any rider splitting lanes in a lane beside another lanesharer is asking to get creamed. The smart rider will follow your split.

I've had plenty of riders come up on my tail while I'm splitting and either draft me, or if they seem intent on going faster than I, I'll slide into traffic, wave them one and then enjoy the parting of the seas they are likely to create.

Just turn on the low beam

SantaCruzRider's picture

The different modulators vary a bit, but I believe that the most popular modules all have the availabiltiy of switching it off, typically by switching to high or low beam.

I don't have one, but I think they are amazingly eye catching. I've put off getting one primarily because I drive alot on mountain roads where I can sit behind folks for a good amount of time and worry that I will forget to turn it off and become overly aggravating to the guy ahead of me.

But, I have added aux lights to the sides of my fairing to give the bike lighted width and I also notice that they "jiggle" at a bit different rate from the headlight, so hopefully increase my visibilty to cars. They are also awesome at lighting the forested sides of the road, which is great for lighting up deer suffering from depression and intent on commiting suicide on the front of my bike.

Yes, you can indeed switch to low beam

Rab's picture

Yes, you can indeed switch to low beam (dipped headlight) which disables the flashing, but on low beam you're also diminishing your visibility quite a bit versus high beam.

Alternatively, you can wire them to modulate the low beam and disable by switching to high beam. That's probably preferable, but after having used a modulator daily for some months, I felt I was safer without it.

I actually installed it and uninstalled it twice as I thought I'd give it another chance, but I came to the same conclusion the second time.

High Beam

eon's picture

I'm not a fan of having high beams on. Yes, it certainly gets you seen but at the expense of blinding other road users. Was on a group ride yesterday and the guy behind me had his high beam on all day. Was pissing me off as every time I glance in the mirror to check he was still there I get dazzled, leaving me with retina burn as I looked forward again. So yes, it will get you noticed but it may cause aggression towards you.

And be aware any oncoming drivers are not going to see any signals you make.

High beam debate

SantaCruzRider's picture

I've wondered about that in the past as well, as I ride with my high beams on during the day.

I think I've always hoped that lane positioning (I'm rarely in the center behind a car) might help minimize the glare, but I'm only guessing.

So far, the only aggression I've seen is motorists who are stopped and see me lane splitting toward them and will pull into my path to keep me from getting past. It's really pretty rare, and I always figure it's fellow commuter who's jealous of my progress and is too much of a pussae to ride.

I don't agree

Rab's picture

I don't agree that a properly adjusted full beam blinds other road users; not during the day anyway.

If I'm lane splitting behind another motorcyclist, I'll dip the light (use low beam). If I'm sitting (static) in traffic behind another road user, I'll dip the beam. If I'm going through a tunnel I'll dip the beam.

Otherwise, it's on full time.

My life is far more important than someone else having a slight inconvenience.

""""My life is far more

Elwood1960's picture

""""My life is far more important than someone else having a slight inconvenience.""""

A blinded oncoming drunk is not a life saving experience.

In daylight hours, high beams are inconvenient to others at times. At night you are blinding folks, putting them at risk, and in some cases, that includes yourself.

Personally, I find the advantage if high beams for visibility over rated. If they dont see the lows, they wont see the highs, they are looking at the text they are typing. (-;

2006 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
Sales, Peterson's North Miami Store

Well this guy was on a

eon's picture

Well this guy was on a V-Strom and I have read they have extra bright lights. The fact he was behind me for 10 hours didn't much help but it was certainly a very very bright light that I could still see if I shut my eyes.

I'm not sure what you mean by "properly adjusted full beam". Aren't full beams by definition shining directly out in all directions?

The guy on the V-Strom could

Rab's picture

The guy on the V-Strom could have had hi-intensity bulbs and/or poorly aimed main beam. V-Strom and KLR650 etc. riders often buy all that adventure accessory stuff even if the only off-roading they do is on Safeways parking lot.

That aside, when riding behind someone for an extended length of time like that, it's just plain common sense to dip the headlamp. Isn't it?

On your other point, no, full beams should not be shining out in all directions.

If they are aimed too high, then you light up all the freeway signs for miles ahead, but there's very little light going onto the road in front of you. I know, I've seen this on my current bike before I adjusted the aim downward (a vast improvement).

On modern faired motorcycles they can (and should be) adjusted both laterally and vertically so that at some point, the beam ends on the road (not off into the horizon). On all bikes (even old ones), you've got at least an up/down adjustment. I'll bet if you look in your user manual, it'll show you how to adjust your headlamps low and high beams.

I remember seeing cars in Europe with a headlamp beam adjuster on the dash to allow the driver to re-aim the headlamps when carrying heavy loads in the trunk.

Anyway, this has always been a controvertial point (full beams during the day or not), so I guess we can agree to disagree.

When I started riding more

IBA270's picture

When I started riding more and more cross country trips, it became evident to me that motorcycle headlights, at least the one's being produced when I started riding, were woefully underpowered to be safe. My first mount, a ZX-10R (no, the 1989 model) had an H4 headlight, and couldn't reliably be upgraded...I had to tough it out with an 85w highbeam...not much difference. My next mount, a '93 BMW K1100RS also had a single pathetic H4, but it also had 700w of power. First thing I did was add 85/100w main bulb and two (that's right, 2) six inch 110w PIAA. Let's just say it made traveling towards Crawford, CO at O'dark thirty a wee bit better!

My main road tripping bike now is a BMW R1150RT with full HID conversions, and an additionally 220w of forward looking lights. I only run the single (low beam) during the day, but it's much higher intensity light is much brighter than a halogen.

I am cautious to try not to blind the drivers in front of me, or oncoming of course, but it's a fine line between being seen and not. As someone mentioned, left turning drivers are one of the main causes for vehicle/bike collision...actually, they are the highest. Even with a high beam, some people have a hard time judging closing distance.

Here is another idea if you want to increase your visibility; try lower, fork mounted lights much like motolights. This gives oncoming drivers three lights instead of a single light to judge closing distance. I have not tried them, but I have heard that they seem to work...with the added advantage of not blinding drivers in front of you...

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

About Red: It seems to be a

CBBaron's picture

About Red:
It seems to be a standout color in good light but in low light conditions it is not much better than black.
White is much better and ofcourse hi-vis if very noticeable in near all conditions.
I have a hi-vis jacket and silver helmet. I intend to add hyperlites LED running and brake lights with modulators for the rear. Hopefully i can figure out a bright economical addition for the front. I will also add some reflective tape to my helmet and perhaps my bike.
I try to be as visible as possible. It is too easy for a small vehicle to be lost in the background. I figure it should reduce the number of people who "don't see" me so it reduces the chance that someone will hit me.
I have been an all weather bicycle commuter for several years and I have noticed first of all how hard it is to see people with dark clothing in poor conditions. And how much easier yellow, white or hi-vis stand out. I've also noticed that people appear to move left to pass me earlier if I am more visible.
I will be the one that looks like a dork, by I could care less what i look like, just that you notice me. :)

Craig

Helmet color

Gary856's picture

I like the look of a silver helmet but I've read, and agree from personal observation, that silver helmets are not very visible on the road since it blends into the grey background.

To me, a bright yellow helmet is the most visible during the day, while a white helmet is the most visible in low-light condition (dusk, night). Adding reflective band/tape brings it up to a whole new level for night visibility.

I think Arai

JackTrade's picture

used to make a helmet in solid, day-glo, safety-vest orange. That's probably the ultimate in helmet visibility!

Silver helmets look great with black leather gear IMO, for a cool retro look. Saw a guy this weekend on an old BMW dressed that way.

Silver helmet + black leather

Gary856's picture

One day about 1-1/2 year ago I was standing across the street from an old Spanish mission (here in Fremont, CA) and a guy wearing a silver helmet and a fitted black leather jacket slowly cruized by on a BMW bike. That was like the scene from an old European village - very nostalgic and cool. I wanted an outfit like that. But when I started riding and thinking about safety, hi-rez took priority. I bought a silver helmet and a yellow helmet, put them side by side on one end of room at night, and looked at the from across the room about 30 ft away. The yellow helmet won the dim-light visibility contest, so the silver helmet went back to the store.

high beams

jcwhite's picture

Ten cents on the high beams debate: I used to ride with my high-beams on, since I had read that it increased visibility, and made sense to me. I stopped after I had someone flash me (the "you're being a jerk" signal) with their high beams while I was manoeuvreing in traffic - I was pulling around a slow right-turning vehicle when I was momentarily blinded by the oncoming car (and there was a popular cross-walk right in front of me, and another car turning right off the side street). After that little stunt I decided it wasn't worth it.

The high beam / low beam dilemma

Gary856's picture

This has been a dilemma for me. I ride in the hills at night a lot. Without any street lighting to illuminate the distant surroundings, low beam doesn’t provide enough sight distance and reaction time. High beam really helps both in sight distance, and in orientation in total darkness. However, whenever there’s oncoming traffic, I’m faced with a dilemma. I would prefer to stay on high beam, and fine if the oncoming vehicle is also on high beam because I just look at the road and avoid staring into the light. However, being on high beam is often considered rude by other vehicles, gets them mad, and I’ve had them flashing their headlights which was blinding and much worse than a steady high beam. If I switched to low beam, I’d loose a significant amount of sight distance. Especially in the glare of the oncoming headlights, I would be riding half-blind until I’ve passed the oncoming car and switched back to high beam. (Yea, I know, slowing down more in the dark would help too…)

Riding at night with your

eon's picture

Riding at night with your high beams on is a completely different story than during the day. Your eyes will have adjusted to the dark and are more susceptible to being 'blinded' by any bright light. That's why you NEED to switch them off for oncoming traffic. Do you think the rules are different from riding a bike to driving your car?

High Beam use during hours of peak brightness....

Sean_D's picture

Due to the lack of atmospheric filtering the sunlight can be very intense at high altitude. Anyone who has spent time at altitude knows exactly what I am talking about. I used to live on the East Coast and it isn't anywhere near the same.

During peak hours of brightness, low beams are simply over powered. There are times that you can't tell if a vehicle even has any lights on until you are passing it. I definitely ride with my high beams on during those times. I am not even sure that high beams offer the necessary visibility, but they have to be an improvement over low beams. I will turn them off when stuck behind someone for any distance, at a stop sign or traffic light. But there are times when those high beams may be your best bet in being seen from any distance.

Of course I am only talking about what is maybe a two hour time frame of when I do this. My basic rule of thumb is if I can't tell if a vehicle has daytime running lights on until it is passing me, chances are they can't see my low beams until I am passing them. Very unscientific I know, but until someone flashes me to indicate annoyance I will keep doing it.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

The color of light..

Sean_D's picture

...adding to my previous post. I know a number of folks around here who prefer the Hyper Yellow bulbs. They claim they are more visible during peak daylight hours. The logic is that peak daylight hours are a very bright white/blue light and that the deeper yellow of the Hyper Yellow bulbs stand out in contrast. While that may or may not be true, I have been hesitant to try them. I am not sure what effect they would have on night time driving. Decreased visibility? Is the yellow light kind of odd? I understand there are some questions about their legality? Anyone have any feedback or experience with he hyper yellow bulbs?

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

+1...yellow bulbs work very

IBA270's picture

+1...yellow bulbs work very well for visibility. FWIW...technically, NONE of my lights on my road bikes are legal from a pure "book" definition. In well over 300K miles with these various configurations, I haven't gotten even a single question about it.

I can't give advice on how you should configure your lights, but I do feel like reasonable lattitude is given to motorcyclists trying to improve their visibility to other drivers as well as enhance their own ability to ride in less than optimal lighting conditions.

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

... I appreciate the feedback on the yellow bulbs

Sean_D's picture

I really appreciate the feedback on the yellow bulbs. I am glad to hear that seem to work as well as advertised in terms of visibility. I have been running that PIAA Super Plasma GT-X because of that purple hued low beam, but I kind of like the look of the yellow. So you don't find them too funky for nighttime use? When you say "work very well for visibility" I wasn't sure if you mean making you more visible, visibility of the road and surroundings, or both.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

I should have

IBA270's picture

I should have clarified...yellow lights; fogs, drivers, running, etc. really seem to stand out well on motorcycles. Main lights do as well, but you normally lose both distance and illumination capability. For instance, you will have a difficult time with some shapes/colors, etc. if you're only running a single yellow light vs. a nice, bright PIAA or Silverstar main headlight.

Sorry for the confusion!

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

I appreciate you clarifying..

Sean_D's picture

... I do only have the single main headlight, so perhaps the PIAA plasma is the best bet for that. Gives the low beam a purple tint and a bright white high beam. I need to add some running lights, so that may be the better choice for a yellow bulb.

I had a Silverstar in there before. Still keep it as a spare, but I liked the effect of the Plasma and I am hoping it is more eye catching and attention getting. No way to know for sure I guess. This is a pretty good side by side for anyone who may be interested http://www.aeriostyle.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=4339

Though the PIAA bulb here is more blue, while the plasma has more a purple cast. Photos on the second page show the plasma side by side. Not the best photo though.

I am giving serious thought to doing one of the H4 to HID conversions though.

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

Sean, the HID conversion CAN

IBA270's picture

Sean, the HID conversion CAN BE really nice! There are a few drawbacks though, so do some research. Notably;

1) Not all reflectors are made the same; some housings seem to through the new HID light well, others not as much.

2) You won't have the ability to dim the bulb; there is no hi/lo. There ARE kits with a small servo motor that "directs" the light onto different points of the reflector to help control how the light is thrown from the housing, but the effectiveness is questionable, as are the long term reliability of them.

3) While most kits are "plug and play", I would recommend AT LEAST running a new, higher gauge ground wire. Ground is notoriously the weak link on most systems.

4) You'll need to adjust the angle of your light much lower. If you have an easily adjustable headlight, then Bob's your uncle. Otherwise, you'll have to find the happy medium.

If you go that route, go with the lowest KV number available. The lower number= the most white light, which gives the greatest vision for you...and (from what I understand) draws the least number of unwanted questions by the cops.

Even with all of this, I haven't heard the first person tell me it wasn't one of the best upgrades they done for night riding/visibility.

HTH...

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

Wow.. great info..

Sean_D's picture

.. That is great info. Thanks much for the reply on that. I will definitely do more research on it. I was planning on upgrading the stock light on my Bonnie to one of the Cibie models through Daniel Stern Lighting. From what everyone says he is some kind of automotive lighting guru. A lot of folks seem to recommend him. Not sure if anyone on this forum has any experience with him?
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/products/products.html

From what I understand the Cibie reflectors are far better than the no-name stock reflectors that come with my bike and work far better HID conversion or not. Maybe I should chat with him about upgrading the reflector with an eye on the HID conversion?

My headlight is easy to adjust, so I should be OK in that regard. I have a question about the KV number. By that do you mean Kelvin Value? If so wouldn't the opposite be true? Lower number is more yellow while higher numbers go from white to blue. Maybe I don't understand how it applies to bulbs though.

http://planetpixelemporium.com/tutorialpages/light.html

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

Stern's site has some great

IBA270's picture

Stern's site has some great info and has been used for used in the M/C community for reference. I'd also agree that that the Cibie kit would be the way to go as far as improving the reflector.

On color temperature...the whitest light is right around 4000/4300-4600. After that, it becomes noticeably blue. Many of the kits you see on cars out there are 7000 and up. They aren't better, they're just popular. FWIW, the difference between a 4300 and a 5000 is immediately noticeable. The 5000 is blue.

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

Lower than 4000 is yellow...

IBA270's picture

Forgot to add that! Sorry.

Allen Dye
MSF Rider Coach
Track Day Instructor
Ironbutt Rally Finisher '03-'05

Thanks for clarifying..

Sean_D's picture

Thanks for clarifying that. It was exactly what I was wondering when you mentioned earlier about the lower the KV the whiter. It seemed to me that the 4000-5000 would be the whitest, with 5500 heading toward blue. I know what you mean about the higher values going bluer. 6000 seems to be somewhat blue, but I have seen kits advertised that are 8,000, 10,000 and 12,000. Those seem to go from blue to purple on the far end. But I had seen some kits advertised at 3,000 and 3,500 that seemed pretty yellow. Not as yellow as the Hyper Yellows at 2,500, but a definite yellow.

So yeah.. that clarification sounds like exactly what I was thinking the colors should be. Thanks for that!

- Sean

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

I remember France used to

eon's picture

I remember France used to have yellow headlights. In Googling that to make sure I wasn't being senile I found the following useful webbikeworld page that I had not seen before. There is an especially useful user comment towards the bottom of the page
http://www.webbikeworld.com/t2/motorcycle-light-bulbs/yellow-light-bulbs....

Are you referring to that second comment from the bottom?

Sean_D's picture

That one was definitely interesting. Sounds like, from what he is saying, that the Hyper Yellow would make an excellent daytime light. Maybe not so great a night riding light though. Maybe PIAA needs to make a Green Plasma for night to put a slight green cast around it .

But you are definitely right about France. It used to be a legal requirement there for yellow headlights. In addition to the lights like the hyper yellow, there are some companies that sell a protective film as well... http://www.lamin-x.co.uk/

If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be. ~Author Unknown

White LED's

This is obviously a very hot topic.

I just wondered, with the proliferation of white LED's in every facet of lighting, WHY ARE MOTORCYCLES NOT DECKED OUT IN LOTS OF WHITE LED's???

I see them in torches, bicycle safety lights, car sidelights, brake lights, signage etc etc.

White LED's would make bikes visible from all angles.
Might look dumb but it would save lives!!

Returnee has just returned to motorcycling after a gap of 25 years.
I'm delighted to join this community!

Check your state laws, but...

...I think white lights would have to be forward-facing only. There area a lot of options for LED running lights and turn signals already though. I added a set of 6" LED trips front and rear to my bike soon after I got it. Though not strictly legal, they add a measure of visibility. Next is to add some running lights, as side visibility at night is almost non-existent.

Reflective

Gary856's picture

cool !:) I want one

TrialsRider's picture

...you should put two round circles on the forehead ! It'll scare the heck out of oncoming traffic :)

Reflective skeleton

Gary856's picture

Or make a reflective skeleton pattern ;-)

A friend has a leather riding

owlie's picture

A friend has a leather riding suit with skeleton pattern. It is freakin' cool. Not sure if it is reflective, or not...